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How would you rate intimacy in your marriage…any type of intimacy?
Do you wonder why intimacy is such a difficult topic in marriage? Do you wish you could understand why husbands and wives see this topic so differently?
How do you know if you’re off target in how you relate to your spouse?
Maybe you feel like you’re not the one with a problem, it’s your spouse…
“You don’t know what you don’t know!”
Listen in as Pastor Luke shares how things that he thought he knew and had a handle on, had a whole new light shone on them in Masculinity Reclaimed. He also discovered that some things that he had once found confusing, now seem so clear!
Pastor Luke explains why he thinks Delight Your Marriage is effective, “It’s easy for women to understand how women feel. It’s easy for men to understand how men feel, but if you can find a man who understands women or women who understand men, I think they have a responsibility to help bridge that gap. Belah has it and she is living into that responsibility. She is bridging the gap for men and for women to understand each other and understand how they are different and understand sexuality. What a blessing!”
So, you’ve been hearing about this Masculinity Reclaimed course and wonder just how effective it is. Pastor Luke shares his observation of others in the course with him…
“Twelve weeks is not a lot of time but I think probably every guy was experiencing some change, if not like insane amounts of change over twelve weeks, from just following these simple principles consistently.”
Pastor Luke also says, “The cost was well worth it. I would pay it again…The value was there. The quality was there. The group time with Belah was there…It was worth every single penny. What would you pay to have your marriage filled with intimacy?…I would be really, REALLY surprised if you regretted it after the program.”
We’re here because God cares about marriages and He has equipped Belah and the team here at DYM to help marriages! He loves you and wants to heal and redeem your brokenness! All who are weak and heavy laden, come find rest at our Savior’s feet!
We invite you to schedule a free call with one of our course advisors to see if we’re a good fit for you.
Transcript
0:02
Welcome to the delight your marriage podcast. You’re joining me belah rose as I dive deep into the beauty, power and truth about intimacy, learn not only the practicals, but the heart behind what making love is all about. delight your marriage. Oh, my goodness, hello, this is belah thank you for tuning in. I know you’ve got a lot on your plate today. And I just appreciate you jumping on this conversation with me and Pastor Luke. Now officially, I’m actually on a sabbatical. So you know, I talk all about rest and how important that is in our lives. And by God’s grace, dy M is just a dream. It is just day after day miracle after miracle. It’s incredible. And the team that God has placed in delight your marriage, you may be hearing from them soon. I don’t know, while I’m away, they might take over the actual podcast themselves, we’ll have to see. I don’t actually know. But the point is that I’m away. And I wanted to make sure you got a chance to really hear more of the transformation stories that we get to witness time and time again, because the thing is, we’re not hearing of the good stories enough. You know, what? The juicy, terrible things that happen that spreads like wildfire, but where are we hearing about the the marriages that are restored and the families that are coming back together and people who are completely turning their lives around and marriages back around. I mean, it’s not that frequently that we hear that. And so I want to just push out as many stories of hope that I can, so that you can experience that kind of hope and faith in your own life, if he can, if God can do it for that person, he can do it. For me. That’s what I want you to really echo in your heart as you listen to pastor Luke story. He’s phenomenal. It’s a beautiful story. And he gives a lot of really great tips and insights that he’s learned through the program, masculinity reclaimed. And if you’ve got a bad marriage, we want to help you make it good. And you’ve got if you’ve got a good marriage, we want to help you make it great. And to do that you can go to delight your marriage.com/cc. And what you’ll do there is get on a call with a clarity advisor who’s been through it themselves. And maybe they came with a bad marriage. And by God’s grace, they made it good. And they stuck around long enough that God made it great. Maybe they came with a good marriage. And God made it great. That was actually a pastor who now works with us faster, Kevin, who’s just incredible. But that’s what he he coined that phrase this morning. So I’m using it over and over again now. But the point is, we’d love to have you tune into today’s conversation. And yeah, just just get a dollop of hope and excitement about what what God can do and others and in you and what you can learn specifically from what he learned.
3:11
Oh my gosh, Luke, thank you so much for doing this. Absolutely. Oh, yay. So you are just graduating the masculinity reclaimed program? Can you just kind of start off with a little bit about you and your history? And what brought you here?
3:28
Sure. Um, well, I’ve been married for 15 years. And I got married really young. So I actually wanted to be married when I was 17. But in Washington State, you have to get your parents to sign off on that. And they wouldn’t have great parents, and they love me a lot. And looking back now that was probably wise. But in any case, I got married just a little bit after 18. And I would say it probably was a little bit arrogant. And then and maybe even a little bit arrogant now, but just was anticipating marriage being a lot easier than it was and being all good. And the reality is I’m finding that even the best of people can struggle in marriage, and it can be difficult. And I always felt like we had a pretty strong marriage and a pretty healthy relationship. You know, we don’t fight a lot. But definitely that that same sort of thing that you you hear a lot where there’s kind of cohabitation, but not a lot of romance, and certain, certainly not a lot of intimacy, probably emotional, spiritual, and certainly sexual. And so as a man, that was something that, you know, was confusing to me. And ever since the beginning of our marriage, it’s been a confusing topic. So they always say people when they’re first married, fight about finances, in laws and sex. And we’ve never really thought about in laws or money, which was really great, but I would say like 80 to 90% of it. any conflict we’ve ever had, has been around sexual intimacy. And now after Mr. One, I realized why. And that’s what’s such a blessing about this program is that I felt so confused and so unaware. Yeah. So in in our marriage, we didn’t really fight about money we didn’t really fight about in laws, but the sexual intimacy was a kind of a constant point of conflict for us. And I didn’t really understand why. And in Mr. One, that is, what was really cleared up for me is I started to understand how she was feeling. And I started to understand how I was feeling and why these things were happening. And I guess what really came to light for me is that over the last 15 years, I’ve had this difficulty, and I’ve been trying to solve it in all the wrong ways. I guess Mr. One that really came out is like, here’s the, here’s the rub, here’s the problem, you could do this, or you can do this, definitely don’t do this, you should do this. And I was finding myself, you know, looking back over the last 15 years, I’ve always definitely doing the things I shouldn’t be doing. And that was really like just eye opening. And now, you know, 15 years of damage done, and but healing is real, and God’s grace is real. And I’m totally confident in that I’m just gonna take the time to do things right, moving forward, and let that transformation happen. And I’ve already seen so much so much transformation in that as it’s happened. But the other thing I guess I would really say Mr. One really helps me with is that it’s, you know, each week you go through a module, and there’s content and the content will have some emphasis, right, like forgiveness, or listening or, you know, these different things. And, and without doing too much of a spoiler for the for the program, like each module has a main topic, right, that you’re going to cover. And I guess this just goes back to my personality and my arrogance. But you know, I’m a pastor, and I thought I was a good listener, I thought I had forgiveness nailed down, I thought, you know, I had a lot of this stuff like, Well, that can’t possibly be the problem. But, you know, you listen to the, the modules, and you see how that should play out in a marriage and what kind of fruit that should have and how that should make your wife feel. And I was just realizing pretty much every single module, I’m missing the mark, I’m missing the mark, I’m missing the mark. And
7:45
I’ll be completely honest, too, when it comes to the modules, I felt like they were too short at first. And for the for the amount of money I was paying, I was feeling like I wanted more content. But it was it was really quick to find out it wasn’t it was plenty of content, and probably longer would have made it more confusing and more diluted. But really, these were the simple truths. And the simple applications for how to really make your wife feel loved and cherished and understood and to create intimacy and to create romance, right? And of course, you know, you you listen to the podcast, you you maybe you Google, you know sexual intimacy issues, Christian marriage, or something, and this pops up, and you think it’s gonna be a course all about sex. But we really, you know, I don’t know if this is a bad selling point. But you don’t get into a lot of sex until like, week 10 or something. But that’s so good, because you that’s not about the sex stuff. It’s, you know, 90% of the problem is what’s happening outside of the bedroom. And of course, you hear that stuff all the time, right? You hear it in every book, and every podcast, and every counselor says, well, it’s 90% is outside of the bedroom. But, you know, I’ve been hearing that stuff for 15 years, I’m still been confused. And I this is the first time in my life. I just really don’t feel confused about my marriage or like, sexual intimacy. And so you know, it, I think we’re still growing. It’s not like I can say we’ve arrived. But I have so much more hope now. Because I understand what’s what’s gone wrong. And I understand how to fix it. And I’ve already seen those changes, and I’ve seen the trajectory of our marriage change. And so I just have total confidence that I’m on the right path and things are working out. And so I would recommend this to anybody that’s confused about their sexual intimacy or if it’s just not working the way it should be. Because the information here while it feels simple, is just so true. And so applicable and so practical, and I do want to say specifically with belah. The reason I think it works so well is because belah has a special gift to be able to understand men that I just don’t feel like I’ve ever heard from another woman. And, you know, I always say like, it’s easy for women to understand how women feel. It’s easy for men to understand how men feel. But if you can find a man who understands women, or a woman who understands man, men, I think they have like a responsibility to help bridge that gap. Bella has it. And she’s living into that responsibility. She’s bridging the gap for for men and for women to understand each other and understand how they’re different and understand their sexuality. And so, I mean, what a blessing. I know, when I started this course, I really, you know, I think probably most of several guys have probably been in this position, like, you really want your wife to listen to the podcast, you really want your wife to listen to take the course, right. Um, and I remember the first several weeks, I mean, I was, I was kind of praying for that almost every day is it’s like, I just really want this for my wife, because I, I guess I kind of think that they’re the problem. But the reality is, the course helps you see, you’re more of the problem than you think. And by the end of the course, you know, I had a huge list of things that I was working on and changing and seeing changes. And you know, the old adage is true that it only takes one in a marriage to make a change and, and I do want my wife to eventually take the course, she actually doesn’t even know I did this course I on Bella’s recommendation, kept it all kind of secret and tried to make it romantic and all those sorts of things. So my wife still doesn’t know, one day I plan to tell her and I still hope she takes the course. But my heart in it is genuinely different. I don’t want her to take the course because I want to get something from her. I want her to take the course because I want something for her. I would love for her to go through all the same things about you know, understanding forgiveness and the gospel and listening and, and caring and understanding men better and understanding even her own self better and why she might be frustrated sexually and all those sorts of things, but not because I want her to go be fixed. And then so I can get what I need. I feel like I’m already being fixed. And in that process, and our marriage will be just fine, regardless of whether she takes it but I want it for her. And so I can’t speak highly enough of this program. I would recommend it to anybody, whether you’re having a lot of intimacy or not. I just it’s just a helpful program. I mean, you would anybody would benefit from this from this program.
12:44
Oh, my gosh, thank you, Luke. Oh, my goodness, that’s awesome. Um, can I ask you about? What What was it like being in a group of men? And on Zoom? And just the whole experience of it all?
13:03
Yeah, so it, it they in NMR. One, they use something called slack. And it’s just a group communication tool like, you know, Facebook Messenger, or whatever. And it has different categories of things you can talk about, whether it’s things, you’re celebrating questions, you have announcements, you know, and it really helps facilitate this community, even though everybody’s all over the country. And so when you get together on Zoom, you start hearing each other’s stories, you start hearing each other’s problems, but you also kind of know people from slack. And it creates a really neat community and a good vibe of everybody working together. There’s there, it’s not competitive, everybody comes in with different problems, different life stories, there’s people that are younger people that are older people that have just really difficult pasts in their marriages. And then some of us that just have, you know, medium difficult paths, and like everything in between, it’s just, but there’s, there’s not a spirit of competition or judgment. It’s it’s, and I suspect, you know, that’s not by accident. I think Bella does a great job facilitating that. But everybody comes together and encourages one another and lift each other up. And, you know, I was even surprised, because I would say it seems that everybody is is God fearing and Christian. But without the, you know, we don’t know what denominations were in or anything like that, and in or theological differences, but it never has, it wasn’t an issue in the entire time I was in the course. Just everybody was able to encourage one another in the Lord with Scripture with community. And so that was that was fantastic. And, you know, we get zoomed out, for sure with with whatever your job is, you’re probably zoomed out. But this was life giving zoom to me. I never felt, you know, discouraged or overwhelmed or it was it was a zoom call that I looked forward to every week for sure. So you know, don’t be Don’t be turned off by the fact that it’s on Zoom. It’s it feels just as real as if you were in a room with people and everybody’s got their cameras on. And everybody’s, you know, interacting with everybody. It just it feels very genuine as in terms of community.
15:16
That’s so great to hear. And you said something in this that I thought would be really cool to speak to is what was it around? Oh, you talked about confidence in the system, specifically confidence that everyone suffers from the same simple problems. I’m curious what if you would go into that a little bit?
15:44
Sure. One of the things that I really love about Mr. One, and this isn’t a downplay it, this is a play, but its simplicity. And you almost are smacked in the face with it every single week, because this is like, I should have known that. That feels obvious, like, Well, duh. But then at the same time, you look at your marriage, you look at your life, and you’re not doing it. So there’s a problem, right? And I think we fall into the trap. And maybe it’s more men than women. Or maybe it’s everybody, I don’t know. But I think we fall into the trap of thinking our problems are uniquely complex. And our situation is uniquely different than everybody else’s situation. And maybe all that stuff would work for them. But But you haven’t heard my thing, Bella, you haven’t heard my story, you don’t know my wife, right? And it became humorous to me, because this is how all the guys act coming into the first two or three calls. And everybody wants to, you know, tell Bella why their situation is unique and why their wife is different. And if only you knew, and Bella just stays the course and stays true to the simple truths that always work time and time again. And I’m just like, mind blown, because, you know, I was in that trap myself thinking I’m in this unique situation. But watching everybody else, and Bella’s advice consistently to everybody else, is stay the course stay true. And, and things will change. And I mean, 12 weeks is not a lot of time. But I think probably every guy was experiencing some change, if not, like insane amounts of change over 12 weeks, from just following the simple principles consistently. And so it’s not that we have unique, and are their unique nuances. Absolutely right. And I don’t want to say that belah was always good at teasing those out and asking questions when necessary. So I don’t want to say this as cookie cutter, or anybody could do it, because they couldn’t, I think Bella gets in there and, and make some really precise cuts, when needed to get things on the right track. But 80% of the counseling his look, stay true to the system, and it’ll work. And one thing that I love, I’d be, I’d be so curious to hear how it worked in the early days, when you didn’t have the track record of success that you have now, if you had the same amount of confidence in the system, not knowing if it would work or not. But now I see that, you know, it’s it’s been working for, I don’t know how long you’ve been doing this month, three years, right? So it works over and over and over, you see guys lives gets transformed, you have such confidence, to just say well stick with the program, do the steps, it’s been thoughtfully strategically laid out, just stick with the steps and it will work. And just the amount of confidence that you bring to that as it was really inspiring, um, you know, in my own work as I want to as a pastor, I want people to grow on the Lord, right. So I want people to grow much more broadly than just in their marriage, although that’s so important. And I think I get caught up in the idea that people are have these unique, nuanced problems and I have to come in with the super spiritual pastor and solve their problems and really, the reality of it is, hey, are you reading your Bible? Are you praying? You know, like, just do the simple things just have joy are you being thankful the gratitude such a huge part of them are one like Paul says, Be joyful, always pray continually give thanks in all circumstances, right. Are you doing praying and giving thanks? I mean, if not start there and just see what happens when you do the simple consistent things and trust the system. Your situation is not as unique as you think it is.
19:41
Oh my gosh, astounding. Astounding. Luke, um, oh, my goodness. Okay. So, if you um, if a gentleman is listening, and you know if they’ve got objections similar to you, you know, obviously, I’m sure you had no nervousness coming in. And that kind of thing. Are there any things that you thought about? Or were concerned about from the get go that you could speak to, at this point, even investment? or what have you?
20:13
Um, yeah, so for me the two objections or nervousness, the, for me the two reasons I was hesitant about Mr. One was the time commitment and the cost. And the time commitment was just a matter of me trying to really think about what are the most important things to me. And of course, you can intellectually understand the God is the most important and your marriage is second. And I think we would all probably admit to that, but that’s not how we live our life. And so when I really just thought about it, and said, you know, if I don’t get my marriage, right, and healthy, none of the rest of this matters, my ministry is not going to be effective. My role mentoring students where I work is not going to be effective, my parenting is not going to be effective, like I’ve got to put the time in, to make this work to learn. And so the time thing was, was definitely that’s kind of how I reconciled that. And to be honest, it’s not an insane amount of time, like I said, the content is, is, is not crazy long, but it’s it’s enough. And there’s, you know, you do some writing little writing projects, not essays, but you know, making lists or make thinking things through. But it’s not a crazy time commitment, but it’s an intentional, you have to set aside, I would say an hour a day to be doing the stuff and thinking about it would probably be plenty of time. And the other part was the cost. And you know, I’m not a super wealthy man. But the the cost was just well worth it, I would pay it again, over and over and over it was the value was there, the quality was there. The time the one on one time with our one, you know, the group time with Bella was there. She has good coaches that are you know, that are on the slack even more than she is that was a value. And so even though the price tag was was higher than I was expecting, when I did my call, I signed up. I mean, it was just it was and I don’t regret it. So I guess that’s what I’d say, coming off the back end. Even though the price may feel a little high. I don’t regret it at all, it was definitely worth every single penny. I mean, what would you pay to have your marriage filled with intimacy as worthy to me, I mean, I don’t know I pay more I pay all the money, I’d have to have that. So it was worth it. And all the years of just confusion and not understanding what’s going on. It was well worth the financial output to get those answers and to see what I needed to see.
22:47
Amazing, amazing Luke. Oh, awesome, I guess um, if there’s any other any other thoughts or, you know, if a gentleman’s on the fence and you want to say anything final, any other things.
23:03
Um, you should do something, you know, if you’re on the fence about thinking about this program, you should do something. And I would say you should do this program. Because you know that you’re not going to get the same accountability reading a book, you’re not going to get the same accountability, or specific specialized coaching, listening to the podcast, you’re not going to get the systematic approach either with a lot of these other things that you might try. And so if you’re on the fence, I would say just pull the trigger and go for it. Because I would be really, really surprised if you regretted it at the end of the program. I’m really surprised because the systematic approach the accountability, the community, everything that comes with the program is just I’ve not never seen anything like it for marriage resources anywhere in 15 years of being married and being a pastor. I would say go for it. If you’re on the fence.
24:03
Oh my gosh. I’m trying not to make my voice heard while you’re talking. But I’m like inside, I believe you say go these three things. Thank you. You’re welcome, Ella. Oh my goodness, I don’t know if you’re open to this. And if you kind of consider like somebody out there who may have been feeling a similar way that you were, um, and not you know, it just this idea of like praying for them that they would feel comforted or whatever it may be, if this is the route for them, great. If not, whatever it is, but would you be willing to kind of have them in your heart and pray for them? Oh, we’re really okay.
24:48
Father in heaven, you’re a good God, and loving and gracious to us and patient. And so we just worship you and thank you for that. Yes, I do pray for the men and women struggling in their marriages. There’s so much in the world to attack and pull us down and bring us down, I pray that you would just be present and bring healing, and support and help in all of those times, Lord, for the men considering this program, that it would be a good fit, I pray that you give them the boldness to pull the trigger. I pray that you provide the financial means I pray that you provide in the schedule, I pray that you’d work on their heart and give them true transformation and hope. Not because we’re amazing, but because you’re amazing. God, I just thank you for belah I thank you for this, this program and everything that she’s doing and the lives that are being transformed, seemingly daily. So I just pray for those men that that are considering this, that that if it would be your will. And if it would be right for them. You would give them a piece about doing it and you would push them in the right direction. We trust you to do that, Lord, because you are good. And we ask this in your name, amen. Amen.
26:03
Amen. Oh my gosh, thank you so much. So thank you so much, Luke. My goodness, I hope that that has blessed you, dear listener, and you are inspired and encouraged that. Yeah, there’s there’s hope in this. There’s hope in this. Don’t give this thing up. Don’t give this thing up. There is hope. We’d love to have you on the inside. If this is tugging at your heart and feels like you need to be part of it. Go to delight your marriage.com/cc We can help you. God bless