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(Enrollment is open for Masculinity Reclaimed program — check it out here delightyourmarriage.com/minvite — closes April 4, 2022)
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Skeptical. Yep, that’s Bill 🙂 (Ehemm, *was* Bill).
I don’t blame him. He had been through it. His first marriage didn’t work out.
He came to peace with being single for the rest of his life, until his (now) wife came along.
Things were good for a while. Until they weren’t. And then that lasted 20 years.
Bill went through two major heartbreaks… there’s only so much heartbreak we can go through til we don’t want to have hope that it could change.
Why would it. How could it. It’s been like this for so long.
Well, though skeptical, he thought he would try the program just for the betterment of himself.
And he worked hard — ups and downs — because it’s real life. But after a year of continuing what he learned — he’s here to say that it can change.
Completely.
God brought him closer to Himself than he had been for many years.
And God utterly transformed their marriage.
Truly amazing.
If you’ve gone through heartbreak in your marriage. I want you to have hope. It can change. It can. It can.
You may be skeptical like Bill because of your pain and history. It’s ok. But listen and see if God has a reason you should still have hope.
Enrollment into the same program he took: Masculinity Reclaimed: Be respected, enjoy fierce intimacy & enjoy marriage again! is open now (but closes on April 4 at midnight EST).
Our whole team of graduates would love to serve you and help you to witness God’s transformation just like Bill! All for His glory.
Join us! delightyourmarriage.com/minvite
Prayers & Blessings,
Belah
PS –
A recent grad wrote
“I’m a pastor and have been in full-time ministry for 22 years.
I’ve never, ever felt like I could share a ‘marriage message or sermon’ because I’ve never felt like it was an area I personally had much success in experiencing God’s will in… [after the MR course]
And I have never been more unashamed to say that out loud to her or other people!
Our sex life has never been better…our times of making love are passionate, tender, emotional and spiritual.”
Transcript
0:02
Welcome to the delight your marriage podcast. You’re joining me belah rose as I dive deep into the beauty, power and truth about intimacy, learn not only the practicals, but the heart behind what making love is all about. delight your marriage. Hi there and welcome. I hope that you’re doing well. This is a conversation I can’t wait to share with you. It’s just amazing. It’s just amazing what God has done in this couple. So Bill, just, you know, he’s very he’s one of those naturally kind of skeptical guys, you’ll hear it in his voice. He’s not one to, you know, go with fanfare and excitement. So shockingly, he followed my stuff. Which, again, is amazing. And anyone who follows delight your marriage, it’s just such an honor, that you listen and spend time with me. But Bill’s story is it’ll just shock you. And my hope is, it’ll help you to say, Wow, if God could do it for him, he could do it. For me, there is hope, because that guy walked this thing out. And for Bill. It started with three months. But it didn’t end there. And that’s why I really want to share it with you. Because sometimes, you may hear some of these stories. And you think that doesn’t even make any sense that never would happen in my relationship. It never could happen. But what Bill had to experience is it took longer is what it was, it just took longer. And so that’s what I would encourage you to do is listen, with a heart of you know what perseverance is a fruit of the Spirit, we need to have perseverance. It was so beautiful. Our team meeting this morning, Dana was talking about how she’s really asking God in the midst of what’s going on in her life and different things is she’s asking God for perseverance, you know, for patient endurance, for patient endurance, that you would follow God in this, that you would follow God in this, whatever it may be, if it’s your marriage and intimacy, that you would have patient endurance. So I am just thrilled to have you listen in to Bill’s amazing transformation, all glory to God. And God use this program, masculinity reclaimed, which has opened its doors now. It’s all closing down April 4, we would love to have you on the inside, listen to this story. So you’d be encouraged and pray about whether or not this is the next step you need to take. And we’ve got some different pricing options than we’ve had in the past to hopefully make this available for more. Go to delight, your marriage.com/m Invite. That’s delight your marriage.com/in Invite, and we’d love to have you as a part. God bless you. Let’s listen in oh my gosh, Bill, this has been a long time coming. And I’m so glad we’re
3:19
at too. Actually I am. Oh my goodness. Thank
3:22
you. So yes, can you just give a little bit of introduction to you, your life, your marriage, that kind of thing.
3:31
So like this is this is my second marriage. My first one wasn’t, wasn’t great, didn’t end well. I, I grew up in an abusive household. My father was abusive, physically, emotionally, verbally. Took me a long time to admit that even to myself. It was actually through the divorce that i i got came to finally admit that what that’s what it happened. And it caused a lot of problems for me. And I had a ton of baggage. The upside is as I went through that I found Christ and really kind of turned my life around, got my life into a place where I was literally living every moment with him. Nothing bothered me slow drivers on the road didn’t bother me, which is a miracle. But I was I was in a really, really great place. And I was in a really great place. Not being in a relationship. I was fine with it. And then you know, I started thinking, you know, I think you know, I’ve made a lot of progress. I’ve made a lot of changes. I’m in a good spot, I would be open to it. And so one day I was praying and well, we praying or just carrying a conversation with the big man. And I gave him a list of what I wanted in attributes for a new partner. I said if you’re going to bring someone into my life, this is what I want. It was kind of bold. But about three weeks later I met Melissa my current wife And it was a shocker because she checked all the boxes. Okay, I’m hearing you. So I truly believe that we were meant to be together. And you know, and we, we had a great relationship. And I was very hesitant. She, she pursued. And I think that had a lot to do with the fact that I was in a really good place with Christ. And, you know, after a couple years, we finally got married. And then my career took off, and we had kids and we got busy. And we kind of drifted apart. And it got to be where we were like roommates. And physical intimacy was once every week or two, sometimes once every month or two, it was definitely about getting it over with from her perspective, she never really seemed like she wanted to be there. Which I could tell. I mean, it was pretty obvious to me. We, it was a point of contention, there were a lot of things neither of us was happy. The word divorce came up two or three times, over the years, we went to counseling a couple of times, and it never really accomplished anything. And so I ended up signing up for a bunch of different mailing lists and things in the Christian marriage community. And along came something about masculinity reclaimed. And it struck me, and I shared with you before, it felt like a bait and switch. It was like, you know, hey, you can get more physical intimacy from your life if you just do this. And I’m kind of like, Yeah, sounds like a scam. And I was really, really hesitant. But I think God was prodding me in the back of my mind saying, No, you need to do this. And I said, Okay, I’m gonna go into this, I’m not gonna go into it to fix that part of my relationship, I’m gonna go into it, to find my way back to Christ. Because over those years, I had lost that daily walk. And I knew it. And I’d worked, tried to find my way back, and it wasn’t working. And so I knew I needed to do something. And somehow I felt like this is where I needed to be. And that got me into the program. And I started working through the program and doing the different things that it says to do. And, you know, next thing I know, my wife is initiating. Now, this is something beforehand, she did once or twice a year. And it was now once a week or more. And so that was a huge, huge change. And I’m like, Okay, well, that’s great. But I was also finding my way back, I was caught, I was calmer. I was more focused, I was thinking more about Christ in my life, I still have a ways to go to get back to where I was. But I was definitely seeing changes. And, and if they were there, and I think that one of the things that was really big for me, and it was probably three, four or five months into Mr. To when she we were we were driving back, I think from dropping my daughter off at school. And she mentioned something about getting an RV. Possibly. And she said, you know, the only reason I can even think about that is because you’re a lot more pleasant to be around now than you were. So I knew she was seeing changes. And that was really a big acknowledgement for me. Wow.
8:32
That was a one, I finished Mr. One, a year ago this month. And that would have been early this fall into the summer when that happened. So it was a long time. There was one thing I mean, there were improvements. And they you know, it continued to improve, but there were times, I’m just kind of going like alright, I am changing. But is she ever gonna really come around. I was very hesitant to invite her into the program. We didn’t know how she’d respond. I remember there was one time she I had your podcast up and we might have been at the gym and she looks over my shoulder. It’s on my phone. And if you look at the title of your podcast on a phone, about all you see is delight your marriage sex. And I was gonna like that’s not what I wanted her to see. Oh, no. All she knew about your program was that I was in a men’s group focused on marriage. That’s all she knew. And I was like, Look, the titles much longer. That’s not all it is. It’s just what it looks like. And she kind of let it go and didn’t think any more of it. So we got past that. But I was very concerned on how she might react.
9:38
Yeah, I remember that. I definitely had. Okay, two quick questions is How long have you guys been married?
9:45
We got married in 94. So 27 years. Wow. Wow. Two kids, one out of the house, one in college.
9:57
Wow. And when you did Mr. One, she didn’t know you’re doing anything or how did I
10:03
knew that I was in a, because I knew she’d see the expenditure. I said, look, it’s a men’s program that I really think I need to do. And I explained that I was going to do it to try to find my way back to who I used to be. And she was, of course, very much in favor of that now, somewhere along the road, we came up that it’s, uh, you know, it’s a marriage focus thing. And that’s really all she knew. We didn’t discuss it much. She never really asked. She knew that on Thursday afternoons like, I did my group.
10:32
Yeah. And then you graduated three months of Mr. One, you decided to do Mr. To what was the impetus?
10:40
I knew, I knew that I’d seen some changes. And I knew that I needed to stay accountable to stay in touch, or it was all just going to go away. And I really, I and I was feeling good about the progress I was making. But I knew I have a long ways left to go. Still do. I’m probably ever done.
11:02
Right? I’ll raise my hand there.
11:06
But if I wanted that contact, I wanted that. That ongoing input. And there were times where I was really struggling where my wife would would get distant again, or things weren’t going well. And, and I would vent on Slack. And the guys were great if that support system is just invaluable in in getting through it.
11:31
Yes, yes. And, and so then, you know, you you kept going for a year. And you know, I guess a couple of months ago, the DUI mentor, awesome, because he mentioned Hedvig, he asked you if you’d be willing to do a testimony and you’re like, I’m not sure.
11:55
I was he asked when I was not in a real good place. I think we were in a rough patch. And I just she wasn’t doing any work. I was doing the work. And I just felt like it was very one sided. It just was like, I don’t think it’ll come across. Well, if I do it now. So I was like, not not a good time.
12:16
Yeah, yeah. And that’s something I appreciate you Bill, you’re not you’re not one for you know, you’re not just gonna talk up something just just because worked with you long enough to know that. Um, okay, so then what, what was the transition to where we are
12:36
now? Oh, I had been agonizing over whether or not to suggest to Melissa that she may be whether actually to ask her if she was interested in doing something as well. I thought about introducing the podcast, and I communicated with you about it, you know, what do I do? And how do I approach this? And what are the options if she’s in favor, and I’m still very hesitant, because I was seriously concerned that if she saw the physical intimacy aspect of it, primarily, then she was going to go You mean, you’ve been doing this the whole time for sex. And that would just kill it. And so I, you know, we, you gave me some coaching, I think it was on one of the monthly calls, and we interacted some over email. And I finally we were out having a beer at a local brewery, and they have games you can play, we’re playing a game or we’re doing stuff. And finally, you know, I sit down, I’m done with the game. I said, you know, I want to talk and use some of the guidance you gave me and I asked her, I said, Would you be interested in doing anything? And I was very ready for her to say no, and I would have been fine with that I knew I needed to be and she immediately responded. Yeah. Well, I was like, wow, okay, so I mentioned that, that the program I’m in has a women’s program and asked if she’d be interested in looking into that. And she said she would. I don’t know that she was certain about it to begin with. But I know she told me that during the intake process, one of the one of the testimonials that she was asked to review, I think it might have been Ali’s really struck home with her and it was the Okay, when I’m intimate with Him, it’s all about duty, and I don’t really want to be there. And she was like, oh, man, that’s me. And that’s wrong. And so she then knew she needed to do something. So she did sign up for the program and has been doing the videos and the daily gratitudes and, and things like that she shares a little bit now and then about what I think her group recently started doing a checklist different from ours, but a checklist. She shared a couple of things that were on that list with me, which was a which was both surprising and pleasing. So yeah, so now she’s in the program too. And it is absolutely made a difference. You know, I if you’d have asked that app if you had asked me a year ago, even at the end of summer one will this day ever come? It would have been yeah, I hope so. But I don’t think so. I was telling the guys yesterday one of the one of the videos I don’t remember it was in the Mr. One material or something you had us watch, but there was a, a wife. And she said, Well, I watched the video for module so and so. And then I jumped online and went out and bought some things that were for my husband and I was like, I want my wife to do that module. I’m thinking that she may have recently done so. So, yay, miracles do happen. God works. Just praise God for the changes that we are at a place I never imagined. Never. You know, I hoped I hoped and prayed, but I really didn’t think it would ever get here. So it, it took a long time. It took a lot of sticking with it. And I for me, I maintain the focus that yeah, this is yes, this is about my marriage, but it’s really about me and my relationship with God and getting back to where I want to be. And, and the rest of that is all great. And I stopped I now with an improvement. I’d be careful not to let my focus go on too much on the marriage and not on me and I am struggling with that. And so I’m I’ve got a couple weeks vacation coming up and just by myself that I’m hoping I can use to focus. Yes, just my relationship with God. Yes, Bill.
16:20
That’s, that’s incredible.
16:22
It’s awesome. It is it is truly truly amazing. Yeah, it’s to think where we were a year ago where we were roommates. We watch TV together. Intimacy was incredibly rare. And not really all that enjoyable. But other than not emotionally, physically for me, son for her rarely. Because she just wasn’t interested. And now she’s, she’s actively participating. She’s still doing a great job and she’s still the primary initiator. And she made it she told me she realized she wasn’t present. And she’s really working on being present and in it shows it you can tell and she’s focusing more on her enjoyment, which has always been frustrating to me that she didn’t.
17:17
Right. So right.
17:20
That’s right. Right. Never never would have thought I didn’t think I honestly even coming into the program. I’m like, Yeah, okay, maybe but I’m not going to get my hopes up too high. So it works
17:35
I’m speechless I have nothing to say.
17:40
It’s simple as that. It does. It’s truly a miraculous change. We we really it is you know she’s she’s doing the lights for me. Probably better than I’m doing the lights for her. Just you know, it’s all it’s you know, she’s she’s more playful it’s just all around it’s a lot nicer to be together now.
18:10
Well, is is astounding This is a sign Okay, here’s what I would love for you to sit to speak to. For the men because I just My heart goes out to the men that that worked in r1 they saw some they saw some shifts and then they’re like but it was three months and we just didn’t get where I’d hoped and did a DA and they really Wayne from there. Could you speak to them?
18:33
It’s different for everyone right you know I went through Mr. One with somebody and by the Mr. When things were great. Right and and I you know others that at the Mr. End of Mr. One things were falling apart and you can’t base your progress on what others what’s happening with others because it every situation is unique. God’s going to work in his own time in his own way and in the way that is necessary for long term results in your relationship. And you just got to be patient and hang in there it you know, the doubts are going to be there and that’s what that’s where the real value since like Mr. To was, is when those doubts come up. You’ve got people to keep encouraging you. Right and you know, when I was early in Mr to a lot of us were early in Mr to and there weren’t as many whose marriages were doing great. And, you know, now I’m, I’m on the other side of the coin, where mine is doing pretty well. Right and improving. And there’s a couple other guys in my group. That’s true, but we’ve also got guys who are still struggling and so they can see. Now there is you know, a light at the end. You know, we had somebody come in, you know recently out of Mar one frustrated with lack of progress and the cost of a bill. Why don’t you talk for a minute. It was a year okay, just stay the course it’ll happen. You know, that’s where I think one of the big days of MIT is, especially if things aren’t where you want them to be. You’re having gotten there three months, three months after how many years? You know, we had been living as roommates. But when I came in Mr. Winn been married 2526 years, we’ve been living as roommates for 18 to 20. Wow, probably, after Epic is my wife loved being a mom, she was all about being a mom. But when she became a mom, she kind of stopped being a wife, in many ways, right? And I didn’t know what to do. And then I, of course, reacted in the wrong way. And it just spiraled. So you know, you can’t you can’t fix that much damage. In three months. The fact that it got fixed in one year is still amazing. You know, and for some, it may be six months. I mean, it may be two years. But the point is, it can be fixed. Um, I’ve seen some amazing things happen in the program, you know, and and it’s, you just gotta, you just gotta hang in there. Yeah.
21:07
Oh, man. Beautiful, beautiful. I just love it. I’m awesome. Well, okay, so for the gent that’s listening, who’s on the fence about Mr. One? Who might be in the same spot that you were in of like, listen, belah you got all this enthusiasm? It’s got to be fake.
21:27
Oh, no, it’s not fake. It’s real. This. There’s something about disparate. And I don’t know that I can put my finger on it. Right. I mean, I came in, I came in with the attitude of I knew I needed to work on me. I don’t know that everyone does. But it very quickly becomes apparent that that’s, that’s the goal. And so it you, whoever you are recognized, yeah, you got to fix yourself. It’s not just her takes two to tango takes two to make it work takes two to make it not work. So recognize that and really come in with that, right? Yes, this will do something for marriage. Yes, it’ll do something for your intimate life. But it really is about changing who you are. To be the right person, the person you’re supposed to be in that marriage to make that nurse become what it’s supposed to be. And it works. It does it. There’s reason for the enthusiasm, because, you know, I’ve seen a lot of success in the program. A lot of people not not not not My goodness, like my success, but others as well. There’s a lot of people change marriages out there right now. And this is this is a way they’re doing it.
22:30
Amen. Yeah, that’s amazing. Bill. Okay. Well, what question should I have asked that I didn’t ask any other thoughts that you you need to make sure is out there.
22:41
You know, I think the key is, you got to have your head in the right place that it’s about your side of the marriage, not hers. I do see, I do see some people get hung up on her stuff, you can’t get her stuff. You can’t change or fix her stuff. You can change and fix your stuff. But when you do, there will be a reaction, whether intentional or not on her part. And it may be a little bit of a rough one for a little while, but it’ll get better. She may doubt you’re actually changing, but you just stay the course and prove that it’s real. Yeah, no, and I think that’s it’s gonna have UPS is gonna have downs, right? I’ve had my great times, and you go back and look at some of my slack posts. Not as many lately. That’s awesome. And you know, and there’s, there’s guys that can relate to whatever it is you’re going through there is I’ve had so many opportunities to share my experiences with guys that are going through the same thing. And there were things I shared that I don’t I don’t regularly share about my past. And but, you know, I felt God was telling me, you need to say this, and you need to say it because they need to hear it. Wow. And what’s funny is almost every time at the end of writing it, I look at it and go, Yeah, I needed to hear that. So so if you’re not in the program, just working on your stuff, helping other guys stuff works your stuff to
24:20
yes, that’s nice. Amen. Yeah. Oh, so good. Bill. My goodness. Well, awesome. Okay. Well, any. I would love bill, if you would be willing to the gentleman who really was in your shoes, all of the feelings. I mean, I can imagine the hopelessness, the discouragement, the loneliness. who may be listening to this, if you could consider maybe speak to him and then I’d also love for you to be thinking about if you’d be willing to pray for him while we’re on the college.
24:57
You know, first thing is do it for you. Right One of the I learned this going through my divorce and I learned it in the recovery. If you’re doing it for her, you’re doing it for the wrong reasons you’re doing it for you. You’re doing it because you want to be who you’re supposed to be in God’s eyes and in who you’re supposed to be for your marriage, who you promised to be in your marriage. So you got to do it for you. And you’ve got to keep telling yourself that you’re doing it for you. And it’s the right thing for you, she’ll come around, just keep doing it, because it’s the right thing to do. So Father, God, we thank you for all of the things that you bring into our lives, the challenges, the successes, I want to thank you for, for dy M and the masculinity reclaim program. For those that are out there and struggling with their marriages, looking for support, need your help guide them speak into their ear, and guide them to this program. And let them see it as a way that they can make progress on coming closer to you. And closer to their wives. And closer to that marriage that you intended. For each and every one of us. We ask this in Jesus name. Amen. Amen.
26:10
Awesome, Bill. Thank
26:11
you. You bet. You bet. I love what you guys are doing. I love this program. I’ll be around for a while. at all, you know, I was thinking about this morning, I think, you know, things are going pretty well. How long do I want to do this? I’m like, Yeah, I’m not going anywhere. It’s just too much. It’s just too helpful. There’s still so much that I want to accomplish in my walk with with with God and you know, not having to distraction of the rough marriage. And having that improve. Makes it kind of easier to work on my relationship with him because I don’t have that distraction or that stress. It frees me up we were talking about this on what was it the the alumni chat today about how as things get better, it frees up our minds to focus on more about what God wants us to be doing with our lives. And it’s so true. It’s so true, because there’s that distractions just kind of starts to fade.
27:08
Yes. Yes.
27:11
It’s a wonderful thing.
27:14
Well, I can’t wait to see your wife and, you know, face to face, but
27:18
it’ll happen. She said she feels like she knows you from the videos. But I know she would love to meet you in person. But it’ll be another couple hours before she gets home from work. So
27:26
okay, well, I’m sure I’ve seen her on Slack a little bit. So I’m sure sure we’ll we’ll eventually get the eventually that’ll happen. Amazing. Oh, well, God bless you. This is just, I’m, I’m delighted.
27:37
I’m happy to do it. Just I really believe in this. And I all admit coming in I wasn’t sure. I had my doubts. I said all right, you know, I did that. What was it? The the quick thing, I was like, Alright, I’m going to commit to this. Alright, I’ll commit to it. God’s telling me to commit to it. And then it was like, yeah, I gotta keep doing this.
27:59
I just, I mean, I remember the amount of I remember the amounts of prayers that have gone into this over this year, and just like, look what God has done. I just,
28:10
it is it is it like it’s it’s just nothing short of miraculous. After the effort is damaged, our is our relationship was worth be where it is now is truly a miracle.
28:25
Amazing. All right. Well, we can go into our weekend with this kind of cloud nine, praising God for Amen. All right.
28:43
Absolutely, thank you, Bill, praise God. I’m just amazed at what God has done. And I hope that you are amazed at what God has done. And he’s used this three month program. And he’s used beyond that. That Okay, his journey needed a longer time. But that is a fruit of the Spirit is perseverance. And I want to encourage you to not give this thing up. Don’t give up what God may want to do in your life. When your marriage is healed. We’d love to have you on the inside go to delight your marriage.com/invite for all the details. And it all closes down April 4 Monday, so we’d love to have you God bless