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Hi there! Belah here. Today, I have with me Brad and Kate of onefleshmarriage.com. Together they bring us into the first few years of their marriage when they were too distracted by everyday life and it greatly affected their intimacy. Kate opens up about how it was tough for her to switch gears, from being a full-time mother and homemaker to being a wife who desires her husband. Brad pitches in about how he was too busy making a living for his family that he neglected his wife’s emotions and failed to understand her needs as a woman. Listen in as this godly couple takes us on a journey with their helpful tips and advice on how to vanquish selfishness in marriage and be more present in the relationship, especially during sexual intimacy.

Scripture/Quote:

“The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.” (John 1:15)

“Follow God’s example, therefore, as dearly loved children and walk in the way of love, just as Christ loved us and gave himself up for us as a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God. But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God’s holy people. Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk or coarse joking, which are out of place, but rather thanksgiving.” (Ephesians 5:1-4)

You’ll Discover:

• How the first years of their marriage were filled with obstacles
• As is true for most of us, they admit their individual selfishness caused most of the problems
• How it was frustrating that neither understood how the other felt
• How Kate sought God and He responded in a surprising way (about sex!)
• In response to Kate’s extra love, how Brad decided to become more aware of his wife’s feelings and needs
• What steps they took in order to become more involved, intimate and happy together!
• How your attitude in sex can affect how your husband feels even more than the frequency
• How men in our society often think “if they’re good in bed, their wife will want it more”, but that’s not the case!

Tweetables:

• If we bring our marriage to the light, the enemy doesn’t have the ability to attack.
• That kind of the whole point of marriage it’s giving even when we’re not completely there. -Kate
• I did not realize how important it was for the two of us to be connecting through conversations. -Brad
• I challenge women to go back to the time when it was just the two of you. -Kate
• At the end of a long  day, it was difficult for me to switch gears. -Kate
• I started to challenge myself to not give my wife leftovers. -Brad
• I started to think about how I could give my family ME when I get home. -Brad
• I had to be more than just a paycheck. -Brad
• If we dive into the Word, we see what He is calling wives to do. -Kate
• By the time we started talking about what has changed, she was seeing changes in me that I was not intentionally doing. It was a response from my feeling love from her, so I wanted to make her feel loved too. -Brad
• It may be hard and yet it’s the only way to go. You have to seek out God and ask Him what you need to do as a wife. -Kate
• I felt broken because I desired my husband, but I didn’t desire sex. -Kate
• When you have a cycle of both people being selfish and no one is willing to change, you’re going to stay in this negative cycle. – Kate
• When she changed and I felt really loved from her, it was so natural to want to make her feel really loved. -Brad

 

Thanks for listening! I hope you are encouraged to live in wholehearted intimacy!

 

Love,

Belah

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Transcript

0:00
delight your marriage episode 29.

0:03
Welcome to the delight your marriage podcast, the show where you hear from amazing and inspiring wives sharing their struggles, triumphs, and advice for this journey called marriage. Here’s your host, belah rose.

0:20
All right, well, hello, my name is belah rose. And if this is your first time, I just want to say welcome. And I’m really glad that you’re here. This is an opportunity where you can just spend some time investing in your marriage. And if you haven’t spent time, you know, praying for your marriage today, or thinking about how you can be a better partner today. I’m just grateful that now you’re tuning in, because for the next, you know, while you’re going to be able to listen to an awesome couple. And just before I introduce them, I want to once again invite you to night actually, is my webinar. And we’ve got some amazing feedback so far. I mean, God has been so kind to show up each and every time we’ve had this webinar, I believe it’s really helping people. So if you haven’t yet come, it’s called How to love him most. So it’s really about wives, understanding biblical principles on what it means to love your husband in the bedroom. So I would love to have you it’s really a special time. Again, it’s eight o’clock Eastern Standard Time. And you can sign right up at delight your marriage.com/webinar if you’re listening to this, in the future, go to that URL as well, because the next live free, anonymous, but plenty of spice and biblical principles will be at that web address, delight your marriage.com/webinar. So today, Kate and Brad from one flesh marriage, they’re going to be talking about marital intimacy and what they write about on their blog. And I just am excited. This is actually the first time I’ve had a couple on the show, which is a new dynamic, but it also they each have such great insights. It’s kind of pinging back and forth. So I think you’re gonna like that. And it’s really nice to get, you know, the female perspective than the male perspective. And they, they just complement each other really well. So let’s go ahead and dive in.

2:25
Hello, and welcome back. delight your marriage listeners. I’m really grateful to have Brad and Kate here from one flesh, marriage calm. And they are going to be talking a little bit about their journey. And this is the first time at delight your marriage. We have a couple on. So this is going to be fun. And welcome Brad and Kate, I’m so glad you’re here.

2:46
We’re glad to be here. Thanks for having us.

2:47
Thanks for having us.

2:49
Absolutely, absolutely. So I want to just dive in. Would you all kind of introduce yourself, your family, and a little bit about your day to day life?

2:59
Sure. Um, we Brad and I have been together for over 20 years, we’ve been married for 15 We were highschool sweethearts. So grew up in the same area. And we now live in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. And Brad is a pastor at our church. He’s pastor of small groups and reengage which is our marriage ministry. And I am home with my kids currently two of which we have in public school and our youngest, we’re still homeschooling on top of that I do photography as a side business. And yeah, we were just passionate about marriage because God has worked worked really good things in our marriage. And so we do the local, the marriage ministry at our church, but also have our online ministry and just just really passionate about connecting with people and working on marriages and seeing how we can kind of revolutionize talking about marriage in church and getting people good information. And yeah, just really getting the word out there that God’s plan is good. And that though we may struggle at times, we don’t have to isolate ourselves and deal with it on our own. So that’s that’s kind of where we’re at. Currently.

4:19
Yeah, that’s awesome. And I want to dive into I feel like I already have three questions to ask you, but could you tell me a little bit about the both of your personalities and how that works together? Sure. You guys.

4:33
Okay. We’re personalities. That’s it? That’s a good question. I am more the extroverts were Kate’s more an introvert, although we’re kind of both a little at the middle of the scale in that. So I do get my energy from being around people. Well, she is much more likely to get energy from either one or two really close people or by yourself. And so that’s something that we’ve had Learn how to balance some of the other personality things like I think she is much more the the pursuer when when a conflict happens that, that she has to get to a place of resolving that conflict and get through it and I am much more withdrawn or and would rather avoid the conflict altogether. You know, so we’ve had to kind of learn what that dynamic does to each of us and figure out how to how to meet in the middle sometimes. Yeah.

5:33
Yeah, that is so true. Gosh, I feel like that’s, I mean, that might even be a typical thing of, you know, women often need to talk through it in the men often want to go into the other room.

5:46
Sometimes, sometimes I’ve seen some some couples who it’s race Versa, male and female. But there’s a lot of times if there’s somebody who has that,

5:56
usually it’s one of each, not always Yeah.

6:00
Yeah, that’s a good, that’s good to hear that that’s a dynamic, you’ve had to kind of work through what what has helped you kind of work through that?

6:08
Oh, well, you know, here’s the one part of our story that that Kate didn’t say along the way, like, at some of the most challenging times in our marriage, I was working on getting my master’s degree in marriage and family counseling. And so that that didn’t really fix her marriage. But there is some times that after that, I’ve kind of been able to pull Okay, wait, this is something we need to pay attention to, or something like that. So I would say there’s some helps there, but it didn’t fix anything, any means. Some of it honestly, has been God, really working in both of us and showing us some of the places that we’re both selfish, and learning how the other functions is just a huge gift to them. And so I’ll I’ll say easily, like, there’s times where Kate will go out of her way, because she knows I want to avoid something and she’ll say, you know, it’s okay, we can we can have this conversation later, it’s fine. And give me that space. And that then sometimes, you know, makes me go, No, you know what I know you need to get through it. So let’s talk those kinds of things. So sometimes the giving in the opposite really helps.

7:20
Oh, I see. Oh, that’s really good to hear that that’s like a great nugget for anyone listening. Sometimes, just giving the space actually provides an opportunity of well, actually, maybe I can handle this right now. Right? Or, you know, in 20 minutes or an hour or something, maybe that’s what I need at that time. That’s awesome. Well, this whole podcast is really to inspire and encourage wives and wholehearted intimacy in their marriage. And I’d love to hear maybe a scripture or quote that’s meant a lot to you over the years, or than recently,

7:49
um, I was thinking about that. I mean, our ministry when we are online ministry, when we ask God, you know, to bless it, and I mean, because he asked us to share our story. And, you know, we asked him to give us a scripture to confirm that. And he he took us right to Ephesians five, which is what he was working out in our marriage big time. So that’s one that our whole ministry is built around. So I always like to talk about that one. But it was interesting when you you said, you know, something that recently God is working out and you I just feel lately as, as we’re working in marriages, and talking with couples, there’s just, you know, we hear so many times in the Bible, a theme of, of light and dark of darkness and light. And I just feel there’s so much of marriage that we hide in the darkness and with shame, and just, you know, feeling broken, and something’s wrong with me. And why isn’t this this thing that I wanted so much working? And so, Dawn, one, five, the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it. And that scripture, I’ve just been kind of working out and thinking about it in my mind. And just this theme of that, you know, if we, we bring our marriages into the light, if it’s safe to do so in the church, you know, the enemy, he doesn’t, he doesn’t really have the ability to attack because Well, he’ll still try but because we’re bringing our marriages into the light, and we’re exposing them to Jesus and saying, Hey, I don’t want to do this on my own. I’m really confused. I need help. And we read and I just feel like that the church should be the place for that, that our online ministry is amazing, but that churches should be the place that that marriages can go and can bring their marriage into the light and it’s safe to say, Hey, I’m struggling in this area. Oh,

9:38
that’s awesome. It’s interesting that you mentioned in the light and the darkness, it’s something I was trying to pull it up on my bible where I was just reading in another passage, but I can’t remember exactly where it is but the light in the darkness thinking about even also exposing it to under God so you can you can bring it out in the open and not just be something you’re struggling with in your own heart but something that you can present before him and see God, what? What can you do with this where this is my brokenness work? shine the light on me what’s really happening here? Absolutely so much. Absolutely. Now, when you say that I want to dive into your story a little bit, what a struggle was for you all, because so often we go through these struggles. And we think like you said, we’re the only ones going through it. I think I’ve always found it really helpful to hear. No, everyone goes through struggles. Here’s a really significant one. Yeah, so so go right ahead.

10:30
Like we could share a novel on that. Yeah, we, yeah. We, you know, we were like I said, we were highschool sweethearts, and we both went to colleges and separate colleges. So we were super excited to finally get married. And, and, you know, for us, we worked really hard, but we save sex for marriage, and we just really had expectations and lofty dreams of Okay, now we’re, we’re finally getting married, everything’s gonna be fantastic. And during a lot of our dating, we were at separate colleges. So we spent a lot of time apart. And, you know, within the first year of our marriage, we were faced with a very different reality of, than what we thought marriage was going to be. And specifically, sex was a big misunderstanding for the two of us something that we both really struggled with understanding each other, understanding ourselves. And it quickly became a huge contention between the two of us and, and, you know, specifically it was, it was, me, I was, you know, we got married, I was like, This is gonna be awesome. And, and for all all purposes, it worked physically. But I started to, you know, after the first couple weeks of marriage be like, yeah, I could really take or leave this, like, it’s just not, it’s just not, I just I struggled with desire for it, and not desire for my husband, but just desire to share that time with him. And so it quickly became a source of contention between the two of us and I just was feeling so broken, like something was wrong with me, and, you know, decided sticking my head in the sand was better than actually dealing with it. And, and so, I would say that that was one of our most significant struggles. And it’s why we talk about sex a lot on on one flesh marriage. But it certainly wasn’t our only struggle, we were definitely definitely stuck in our own selfishness, and coming from being two single people to really struggling to putting the other first in marriage. And that included sex. But yeah, so we the first five years of our marriage, you know, I characterize him, it’s very dark, like, I feel like there was a cloud over our marriage, it just felt like we couldn’t shake it, anything we tried, you know, we try something for a little while, be intentional, and then it would fall by the wayside. And after we were married for about five years, God really sort of opened both of our eyes to some of the selfish, sinful things that we were, we were doing in our marriage, and kind of was the wake up call. And we said, Okay, we just can’t continue on like this, because we’re gonna end up like those people who have children and look at each other and have no idea who they’re married to anymore. Yeah, so we started to, you know, what I would characterize as be intentional, more often, but there was still a distance between us there is still a lack of kind of being completely known as far as we can on this side of heaven. And we were trying and I would think, I think we always say, we think at that point, we kind of had a good marriage was kind of that autopilot, like we can maintain this enough to, to make it good, but we would still have some, some heated exchanges and which are normal, but to the point where they would, they would bring separation between the two of us then. And then year 10. You know, through some really crazy circumstances, God’s just amazing. We were caring for my uncle who was sick, and in dying, he was living with us. He had cancer. And during that time, I was just emotionally physically exhausted, and just kept praying that God would break me because I just I desire that, you know, I just wanted to serve this man, and I want it to be broken for Christ and kept praying that prayer. And little did I know that the first place he would choose to break me was my marriage. And this is all things in our house are just crazy. And, you know, he just spoke to my spirit and said, you know, you need to do this with Brad. He’s the person that I’ve given you to go through life with, you know, you’re trying to do it on your own. And so I started to just really seek out in all sorts of ways just emotionally physically, I would just when we’d be done caring for my uncle for the night, you know, We would just go upstairs and I would just, I would just, you know, I just said clean to him. And so I would just clean to him and always talking to him and sharing and just saying, hey, I need you. But a lot of times, it wasn’t saying it and words. And so through that time, our relationship, just really, it just really started to evolve and take off. It was, it’s just amazing what God does. And

15:24
so, you know, through that time of crazy brokenness, God was able, my heart was open and willing to hear what he had to say about my marriage. And so that’s where the, that was the catalyst for our marriage kind of getting to the place where I say, okay, good, was nice. And it was certainly better than the dark cloud of the first five years. But wow, God has so much more for marriage that Brad Knight had no clue

15:53
what I was actually gonna say, you know, she shares that time, so much reflecting on the places where God changed her or impacted her. And I’m sitting here hearing it again, and just going, you know, I think that’s a huge part of our story is that he was able to shift in both of us to see our own stuff. Because I see those same times and the same things, but in the light of God was really showing me things that I needed to change, and I needed to do and how selfish I was at different places. And how I was putting so many things in front of Kate, and, you know, those are the things we used to have fights about all the time. And it really wasn’t until God got a hold of both of us individually, I started to say, you know, what, you need to work on your stuff. And, and that, that we saw some pretty significant changes.

16:49
Wow, can you share some of the details of like, what were the selfishness things that you would be willing to share sometimes that, that helps someone say, oh, that’s something I need to work on? Because they might not see it in themselves right now.

17:03
Yeah. For me, it was definitely, definitely, like the first five years, it was definitely sticking my head in the sand about about sacks and just being like, you know, what, I, I have no desire for it, for the most part, so he’s just gonna have to deal with it like that kind of selfish. It only affects me kind of attitude. And honestly, years, 510, we kind of talked about our marriage in increments of five, for years, five to 10, I was much more willing to show up to, to be there physically, because I was trying to understand him better, but I didn’t realize how much that’s still selfish, because, you know, he knew I was just showing up physically. And while that’s somewhat of a help, it’s not what God designed sex to be. So that was one of my, my big selfish things, probably the other one was that I would constantly constantly want to step up as the leader of our home to be the strong leader. And yet, you know, God really convicted me at one point, during this time, with my uncle, and he just said, you know, how can Brad lead when you’re standing in his way, because I, I, in his lack of stepping up, I would take charge of things, then it just became sort of a cycle of I need to control and, you know, I’d handle everything with the kids, and it would just be easier if he’d stay out of it. And, you know, yeah, things needed fixed around the house. So I’ll fix them or find someone who will fix them. And, you know, those seem like silly things, but it undermines you know, your husband feeling like he is the leader of your family. And so, you know, working on valuing sex in a relationship and seeing how in our relationship and seeing how, and what God wants to do through that was a big one for me. And then also just learning to give Brad the reins of our family and to encourage him as he’s doing. So to not just sit there begrudgingly, but to say, you know, what, you’re doing a good job. And, and now that I have, like, I just see the wisdom that God gives him that is just, you know, so different from myself. And so I think those were two of the big selfish things that, that I am probably within that just learning that when I’m done for the day with the kids, our kids are, we have three kids, our kids are 1110 and eight, and just learning when I’m done for the day that it doesn’t mean I’m just can check out like, you know, it was just so easy to be done for the day and be like, Okay, now it’s my time. And instead it’s, you know, it’s our time and figuring out what that looks like between the two of us and not just thinking selfishly. Okay, I’m just gonna go read my book or watch TV or whatever, and just, you know, yeah, so those were probably the big things for me. You know,

20:00
I’m so grateful that you’re so open about these things, because that’s a really important thing. I think that, you know, women need to understand to be open. And so I’m just so grateful these these details you’re sharing and being vulnerable in that way. And I want to just point out and ask your advice on, you know, you mentioned selfishness a lot. And I think a lot of women struggle with saying, Well, I’m not in the mood, how is that being selfish? Isn’t that me? Just, you know, being who I am? If I was in the mood, I would have to do that, but I’m not what would you say to her?

20:33
Well, yeah, you know, I totally was that girl for many years. And I would say, you know, there is a time and a place for that. I mean, I think that every husband should respect those those times when you’re just like, you know, what, just for me to wrap my brain around that right now is, is just too much. But for me, that was all too often, like, you know, I think that it just depends, you know, if you’re doing that, here and there or whatever. But I would say, that’s the whole, that’s the whole point of marriage, it’s giving sometimes when we’re not, you know, there, and it’s, Hey, God, I need to rely completely on you tonight. Because on my own, this isn’t gonna happen. And understanding very much, and this isn’t to guilt people, but you know, you for both you and your husband, it is the only place the two of you can seek out sexual intimacy. So, if you’re just gonna be like, well, you know, what, I’m not in the mood constantly, you know, that that can become a huge source of contention, and then that can become a place where temptation, you know, the enemy is going to use that. And my challenge would just be to, you know, I think for women, especially for if you’re working full time, or you have kids, it is sometimes hard to switch gears from, I just did the dishes, got the kids in bed, and now I have to think about you, you know, and yeah, um, but I think, you know, I try to challenge women to go back to that time when it was just the two of you, and you could, you know, you were constantly thinking about your husband. So, you know, take those times to, Hey, say, their husband, hey, just give me 20 minutes, take a bath or take a shower. And let me just shift gears, because sometimes it’s like, it’s just so hard to go from one to the other. And, you know, just learn those things about yourself. learn things about yourself about, you know, Brad, and I, to be honest, like I said, we’re an open book, you know, so night times, when we’re really tired isn’t the best time to try and, you know, share that time together. So understanding that about yourself, you know, if it’s, if if you can find a better time of the day that works with your schedules, then, you know, just trying to understand that about yourself. Yeah, I just, I know, that I’ve had to really think long and hard about, about God’s plan for it. And once I finally put it in the proper place in the proper priority. It’s amazing how much God has shown me through it and blessed me through it. And, you know, it wasn’t always easy at times, and I’ll be honest, there are still times I, I just pray, and I say, God, you know, I know we need this tonight. It’s not just he needs it. I know, we need this, but I know I’m not quite there. But I know that you can help me to get there and just try and focus on just my time with Brad and not the list of things that I need to do, or, you know, that kind of stuff. So yeah,

23:33
I was just gonna add, like, that’s certainly not a one sided list. I mean, there was a long time in our marriage, where I would, you know, kind of check out from eight o’clock till 11 o’clock in front of the TV, and then show up in our bedroom and be disappointed that she wasn’t ready to go. And like, you know, we kind of chuckle about that now, but I not only did that, but really had no clue how stupid that was. So, you know, I think there’s a lot of places where it was both of us who were who were not prioritizing the others need because I didn’t recognize how important it was for Kate, for us to be connecting emotionally in conversation and even expressing my desire to her through the day. Because she needed that to kind of think through it and get her mind around it. I didn’t ever recognize that and so then I’d be disappointed when she wasn’t ready at the drop of a hat but that’s not how she’s designed to be so it’s this was definitely two sided.

24:43
Gotcha. Okay. So and I was going to ask you if you could share some details on the selfish so that’s what you would say is that yeah,

24:49
well, there’s some of that that um, you know, I would say some of my selfishness what in in the sexual arena was definitely thinking through my own lenses of desire not really recognizing anything about her. So I think there’s that side. I think there’s there’s definitely other places I was selfish in a one of the bigger lessons that I had was just recognizing how much I put what I was doing at work as my giving to my family and my wife. And I still remember driving home one day, just mentally checking out from a hard day at work and saying, Man, I can’t wait to just, you know, do nothing tonight in that was my mindset. And it kind of just hit me of Wait a minute, you know, I’m going home to at that point, we had two kids and going home to toddler and an infant, a wife who’s been together all day, and all I want to do is check out. That’s a problem. And I just started challenging myself that I needed to give not give my wife and my left and my family my leftovers, but kind of figure out how do I give them me when I come home? Because it I have to be more than just a paycheck, because that’s not all I give to them. Obviously, that’s important. But there’s got to be more there. And that’s a huge part of that selfishness for me was just, I checked out. Yeah,

26:26
I’m really grateful that you said that I love that you said, you’re, you know, you started to look at your wife through the lens of sorry, you were you were looking at your marriage through the lens of your own desire. And you’ve had to switch that to be looking at through the lens of her desire, what, what makes her crave sexual intimacy, and how can I give that to her? I just love that. And I, I I’m interested, Kate, when you mentioned, when I just love both perspectives on this, because, you know, Brad saying that, you know, I had some issues that I needed to deal with. And in case like, well, I also had issues that I needed to deal with Kate, what would you say to the wife that’s saying? How am I supposed to feel sexy, and given this wonderful intimacy when he’s not there for me when he’s he’s not even making me feel appreciated, much less ready to go at the end of the day? You know, what would you say to her?

27:15
Yeah, um, it’s a great question. I think that, or it’s Yeah, I think that the thing that I say to women when they’re most struggling, and they they don’t know, you know, and they feel like, like you said, their husbands just not attentive or not kind of in tune with their needs. You know, the thing that brought about the biggest change in our marriage was me taking the initiative to do what I needed to do. And I think it’s one of the hardest things to tell people because they’re like, Oh, so that’s what it is, I have to change. And I, I get that, that’s tough. But when you have a cycle of two people being selfish, and neither one wanting to change, you just keep the cycle going. And the only way to stop the cycle is for one person to step up and say, Okay, God, I’m willing to be used by you in this marriage and do what you’re calling me to do. And if we dive into the word, especially in Ephesians, five, we see specifically what he’s calling wives to do. And you know, I challenge wives just read the part for you don’t read the part about your husbands, because you’re gonna sit there and say, he’s not doing it. But that’s not, that’s not a reason or license to not do what he’s calling you to do. And so, you know, Brad will say I was the first one to start changing in our marriage. And when I started to do that, he naturally wanted to start reciprocating, I

28:38
wouldn’t even say it was natural. It was like, there was that point that she was saying that she just really felt God saying, to cling to me, and she didn’t tell me that at the time, she just was that something was definitely different. And I remember, honestly, probably two or three days into that saying, Oh, this is nice. And then probably two weeks into that saying to myself, I’m not sure I want to ask what changed. I’m afraid I’m gonna make it go away. But the reality is, by the time we did start talking about it, she was seeing changes in me that I was not intentionally doing it was, you know, a response from wow, I really feeling love from her. So I want to make her feel love too. And like it, it really does work. It’s just really hard to do. And

29:33
it will it really, I mean, you know, I, you know, we’re still unwrapping what God’s desire is for sexual intimacy, and I’m amazed at the things that he shows us but it really does soften you towards each other and it you so much more able to extend grace and understanding to each other when you’re able to share that and so I would just challenge why’s that? It may, it may be hard and it’s some of the hardest advice that I I can give. And yet, I think that it’s the only way to go. You’ve got to seek God out and what he wants you to do as a wife, and just, you know, ask him to help you do that to be to make some of those changes that you need to make. And do it selflessly. Not wondering, or expecting response from your husband, for him to change? I mean, in our story, that did happen, and and people often say, Oh, so you know, if I do what God asked me, then my husband will do what God’s asking him. And unfortunately, that’s not a guarantee, because you know, we all have freewill, we all have choices. But I do believe it’s, it is the way to one of the biggest ways that you can bring about change in your marriage is to just step up and say, Okay, God, what do you want me to do?

30:48
Yeah. And I love the facts. Yeah, right. Exactly. Very good. I love you mentioned I, once I put sex in the proper priority, I’m amazed how God blessed me through it, which I, I just love that insight that once you take that step of faith and are like, You know what, I’m just going to go for it. And, you know, look at the rewards. And that’s amazing. Yeah, I want to ask, if you don’t mind getting a little more just clear on, you know, you’ve got the five years where it’s just really bad than five years of kind of getting better little by little. And then there was this moment when your uncle died or was dying, that all of a sudden, you just felt you needed to really give yourself to him? Can you just kind of share what what that means for a wife when she’s like, what does that mean?

31:35
Yeah, um, all I know is that I, you know, in that time, I was, I was like, the only way I can sway is I spent a lot of sleepless nights just just because of the just the stress and worry with my uncle. And it really wasn’t a bad time. For us, it was just a draining time. And so sometimes, I would just be sitting up at night, and I would just be talking to God and I read a book in that time. And there was a character in the book that just kept praying, you know, break me Lord until and pull yours. And I, I just, I wanted that so much. I just wanted to be broken. And so, you know, I just started praying a dangerous prayer. And, you know, I just kept praying it and praying it every day. And and God spoke audibly to my spirit and just said, you know, cleaned your husband, he’s the one who I’ve given you to go through life with to go through this with. And so I have to be honest, he said that to me, and I was like, what does that mean? Like, what am I supposed to do? So I just remember one of the first nights Okay, Okay, God, I can do this. After the kids are in bed, we’re upstairs, my uncle was all checked on, I just literally just went over to Brad and we were just snuggling. And I was just like, Okay, I’m just gonna cling to him, I don’t really know what that meant. But here he is. He’s who God you know, so, physically, I just clung to him and started doing that every single night. And I can honestly say that when you’re physically doing that, it wasn’t hard for one thing to transition into the other and, and many times we would, sex would be a part of that. But also, sometimes we would just lay there and I would just cling to him, and we just talk, we would just talk about, you know, my day and his day, because he was still going out being the provider for our family, while all this was going on and coming home and helping you with the kids. And, you know, and my uncle, he was a great help with that. And for me,

33:26
I mean, a big part of that time was, you know, we had conversations that probably every couple has, like, we’re going into a new season of life right now, that’s going to be incredibly busy for her because she’s gonna be taking care of her uncle and doing all of this stuff. And so I remember just kind of saying, Okay, for the next couple of months, it is going to be nuts, we’re not going to really have a whole lot of time together. And I just kind of almost geared myself up for that, you know, as I’m sure a lot of couples go through those times. So that’s what I was expecting, and I’m sure out of that came me going, you know, telling myself, Alright, I’m gonna have to do more around the house, I’m gonna have to be, you know, recognizing that she’s not going to be here for me. And then the total opposite was what was happening, where she was being purposeful about, you know, coming in finding me and asking about my day and being there for me and even just snuggling up to me, like, those kinds of things were totally opposite of what I’d kind of prepared myself for. So it was definitely a Yeah, interesting. Interesting, amazing time.

34:36
Yeah, I’m not sure that answer your question, but it’s a hard it’s a hard time to like Express. I just know God spoke to me and I wasn’t sure what it exactly looks like. So I just kind of stepped out in faith and was like, Okay, I’m just gonna cling to Him physically and see what Gods you know, that’s what God said. And we’re just gonna start with that and it was amazing to see how that within like three weeks, like the two of us were kind of like in awe of our marriage, which was kind of crazy.

35:05
Well, and I want to say it, it definitely comes out of a time of prayer too, because I will say this, this was God, making both of us ready to receive some of this. Because if I was still at some of the places I had been, I, you know, she would have been cuddled up to somebody who was focused on the TV. But, you know, God had been working with me on Alright, I need to drop some of that to make space and so, so that there was kind of his timing, and in all that to

35:40
Wow, well, there’s just so many great pieces of this, I just want to pull out one. One part that strikes me is, you know, the morality kind of question in this moment of when you’re caring for someone that’s suffering. And I imagine Did he die after you know, that season? Yes. So, so very sad. And then sometimes, it’s just amazing how God uses those really difficult times, where you’re just confronted with the morality of, Am I living the life that God wants me to live? And then maybe I’m not, maybe there’s some changes I need to make. And that’s really interesting. And then I love that you, oh, so clear that, you know, God gave you the green light to enjoy sex, he gave you a very specific, this is good. And I want this for you. Definitely. And that’s just, it’s just wonderful. Because I think a lot of times, we get it in our minds of wives, especially that this is not something this is separate from God, this is not my relationship with God, this is dirty and bad, or somehow, you know, and and, and I think that if we can just get a revelation that this is God’s design is huge. Yeah. And that this came out of just like Brad said, a time of prayer, where you’re seeking God wanting to be broken. And he says, Well, go have sex with your husband, it just seems so unlike what we think of God so often, but right, it’s so much a part of who he is and what He wants for us in our lives. I love that. I want to ask Brad about what you’ve I mean, what was that difference that you said? Well, I don’t want to say anything. But this is kind of great. I mean, what what could you just decide define that as what was it?

37:15
Oh, um, well. Alright, you know, I mean, we’ll put it out there. I mean, at that point in our marriage, we were probably that once a week, kind of couple. Yeah. But the change from that

37:30
was to twice but that was good. Because, yeah, really, like those last

37:34
Oh, yeah, that was the too much improvement where we had been, but at that point, we were and going from once a week to four or five times a week that that was noticeable, you know, that, that was definitely like a change. But even it was just her demeanor, because I knew how stressed she was, I knew how much she was giving herself, but then she was happily, you know, thinking about where my stress was, which doesn’t, you know, I noticed those kind of things and, and she was wanting to, to make sure that we were, you know, connecting and talking and those kind of things in the midst of all the other chaos going around. So I think that was that was part of that.

38:22
Thank you so much for sharing. I mean, it just gives I think, women just a clear kind of okay, what, what can I do practically? What can I actually do? So I just love that. So it sounds like you’ve kind of narrowed it down to one the frequency much more, which is awesome. And the second of her her attitude towards her demeanor, desire for it.

38:43
Yeah. And, and I would say, desire for just wanting to spend time with me, and maybe it’s right there. Maybe there’s a win there that, you know, my love language is, is quality time. So I was definitely feeling like she’s saying, hey, I want to spend time with you in the midst of all this chaos. Like that was definitely feeding my my love language specifically. So I think that was that was certainly part

39:12
of that. And I think there is that aspect of, I think women can struggle with this, of just checking the sex off like saying that we had it once or twice a week, like, I had come to realize that it was a need in our marriage, but it was like, Okay, let me get my one to two times in a week and check it off my list. So, you know, we can check it off and we can be done and the difference of just seeking you out for that because of the closeness that it was bringing us. And that’s not to say I can be completely honest that I don’t still go through seasons where I have to tell myself and I have to pray and I have to seek God and say okay, God, I’m struggling because desire is something that I still struggle with it but now, I know. It’s hard to explain but now I like know God’s good purposes for it. So I know that sometimes sounds bad, but sometimes pushing through is helpful.

40:06
Well, I mean, I actually don’t think it sounds too bad because I think of like, something I really love is going to the gym, I really love the gym. You know, when I leave the gym, I am on top of the world, man, you can’t get me down. You know, I spent time in worship music, I started talking to God, I got my body moving all this stuff. But there are so many mornings. In fact, this morning, I did not make it to the gym. And yet I know how wonderful it is. I know how God speaks to me during that time. And, and so I think that it’s sex, a lot of times we sometimes we need to get ourselves there before we can even feel the wonderful effects and, and I think that’s different for men and women a lot of times not all,

40:44
but and I’ve done a couple posts on this that a lot of times I’m not like, I’m not completely into it until we’re halfway into it like and I think that is a lot of times how women function. And so just knowing that about myself that Hey, okay, so right now I need a little bit more convincing and you know, whatnot. But once we get there, I’m gonna be totally into it. It’s not it’s it’s just my mind is there, it’s just getting your body to respond in the same way. And, you know, and that’s just part of how it is. And and, you know, people women will often say to me, and I hear so many times, why did God make it such a struggle for us then and, and it’s not always women that struggle, there are men out there that struggle too, because we definitely hear from them as well. I would just say that, you know, if it was something that came to us so easy as putting food in our mouths? Well, it wouldn’t be the blessing that it is because it would just be it would just be like any other thing you do during the day. And so it takes the two of us really, you know, working together and and having that selflessness of, okay, how can I? How can I please you in this? How can I it’s just, it’s just the dynamic that God wants to make it a blessing, it has to be something that you seek out and it’s a mystery, and you’re still unfolding it and unwrapping it. And as we grow and change in marriage, it changes with us and we change and so you have to continue to unwrap it and figure it out. And I just think that’s part of it. And though it may at times seem to be hot, that’s hard. I think it is part of the blessing.

42:19
Yeah. That’s awesome. Brad, can I ask how does it feel for you as a husband to kind of know the struggle with with Kate and just just kind of speak to women that might be concerned like, well, if my husband knew my desire wasn’t so high? Or if, you know, maybe, maybe even there hasn’t been some honesty in the bedroom of like, even wanting at certain time there? You know, there’s there’s a lot of dishonesty sometimes when it comes around sex and absolute. To hear what she actually feels about it. How does it make you feel?

42:49
Um, yeah, there’s, there’s kind of both sides to that, I think, you know, it was really good for me to start hearing her say things like I knew I was just showing up sometimes, because I was feeling that and not sure why that was because I think all men harbored this desire to make their wives really want sex. And like, not only, you know, they feel like, I think sometimes society says this, you know, if you’re good at it, then your wife will really want it. And so I think there is that sometimes that failure behind them that feels like well, if if my wife doesn’t want it, then that means I’m not good at it or something like that, which is really pretty silly. But I think that that feeling is there. So my like, it’s, I think it was honestly, during the time of our blogging when we had to talk about this a whole lot more that we started having more and more conversations about what works for you, what actually do you enjoy? What don’t you enjoy? And those conversations are, like, really important to have, but most couples don’t have them. If they don’t get to the place of saying it helped me understand this when you’re saying I’m need some more encouragement. Like to me that that doesn’t make sense, because I’m not wired that way. So what does that mean? And you know, how does that mean that you want it but your don’t yet or like, you know, just helped me understand that. And I think those kind of things, just understanding each other’s how our mind and our bodies work together. And how different they are, has been really helpful.

44:42
I would add to that, too, is just for women, understanding the difference, and maybe they don’t feel this way, but I felt broken because I desired my husband. But yeah, I didn’t desire sex. And I know that sounds easy, but I never looked at Brad and thought oh, I don’t want to I don’t want to have sex with this man. You know, it’s not he’s not an attractive, you know, I find him very sexy, very attractive. And once we would have sex, I would enjoy it. It was getting to that point getting over my own mind issues of gearing up and okay. You know, you know, we did find out after our son was born, our first our oldest that birth control very much lowered my desire level. So knowing that was was important, unfortunately, we were young when we got married, and we did not look into those things very well, we just thought convenience was the best sort of option. And, you know, I but, you know, I do talk to women lots of times about looking at other options, because it really can mess with your hormone levels. And but, you know, I can honestly say that I never didn’t desire, Brad. But as you know, my desire issues for sex became a problem, it would put a distance between us and I do think that he felt like I didn’t desire him. And I can see how it would feel that way. Yeah, yeah, but there wasn’t that like I’ve, yeah, I’ve always enjoyed my time with him and just find him incredibly attractive. And so yeah, but I do think one can lead to the other, like, if, if your desire husband struggling with desire for sex, and you don’t deal with it, eventually, you don’t desire your husband, either. Because you’ve just let it get to the point where it consumed you.

46:29
Wow, that’s really good. That’s really good insight. Because it’s, um, you know, definitely, I’m right there with you, I will absolutely. Look at my husband across the room, or, you know, when he’s doing pull ups on our chin up bar in our house, or whatever. I’m just like, Wow, what a sexy man I have. And then it doesn’t necessarily translate into the bedroom. It’s just like, you know, and so I just love that you’re, you’re sharing that now, when you mentioned burden troll, kind of dampening the desire. I just as a, you know, disclaimer, you’re not a doctor, but No, you? I mean, can you kind of suggest something that that has helped? Or has? Well,

47:07
honestly, I would just say, research, I would just say to any couples that if they’re struggling with it, and they are using birth control to maybe research it, you know, and no, we’re not doctors, but when I went off it and was pregnant with our son, it was like, the difference like, and I wouldn’t say, I mean, Brad was even like, wow, this is this is different, like, you know, so, and that was we had him at year four. So that was in our marriage. So like, that was the time we’re kind of, you know, just recognizing, you know, different things. So, my advice always young couples, is just research things and think about them and realize that anything you’re putting into your body changes your, you know, change things about you, it’s obviously keeping you from being able to, you know, conceive a child, so it’s going to change things. And just being an advocate for yourself and looking up things and making sure you’re understanding what something does to your body. You know, we’re certainly not preaching one thing over the other. And if somebody uses oral birth control, that’s totally fine. But, you know, neither of us, while I was struggling with this ever really thought about it, it was until I until we stopped taking it and had our son that I was like, Oh, this is different, better, you know, and we hadn’t had sex before marriage. So yeah, we were the only people we’ve ever been with. So I had no idea. I just started taking birth control, like, three or four months before we got married. So I had no idea. You know, and so just just understanding that anything you put into your body is going to affect it and change it and potentially just know on what you’re dealing with.

48:44
Cool. Yeah. Well, that’s, that’s great, great advice. And I wanted to just kind of, before we move on to kind of the next section I want to ask Brad about, I love that you said that in our society, we often men feel like, well, if I’m good at it, then she’s gonna want to want it more. Can you just unpack that a little bit more for what that means? Oh,

49:08
I think you know, men, not Yeah, this is a tough one. But most men not only have a desire for sex, they have a desire that they, they, their spouse enjoys it as well that it’s mutually beneficial. And, and I’ve heard from so many guys that feel like you know, their, their wife is just showing up kind of thing, which and they and they’re actually saying that sometimes that’s almost worse than when we didn’t have it because showing up is just bringing like it’s a release that that’s all it is. It’s not an intimacy it’s not a connection it because it feels like she’s doing out of obligation and I’m not doing it well enough to make her enjoy it. And and that’s that all of that is not necessarily true. Like there’s some definitely falsehoods in that belief. But I think it’s important that, you know, wives understand that your husband really, really desires to make this work for you. And if there, it’s not working, if, you know, whether it’s in the moment that it’s not working, or even in desire, it’s not working. Yeah, he, he wants to learn how to do better. And I think there’s a place where he just, yeah, sometimes needs education, and sometimes needs encouragement. And yeah,

50:46
that’s good. Yeah, that’s really good. And I wonder if it’s not just a conversation that a wife listening can have with their husband? Honey, do you feel like I’m just showing up sometimes?

50:56
How does that feel to you? Just that honesty, bringing some honesty into the bedroom is huge. And maybe, literally, maybe it’s not when you’re in the bedroom about to start? Maybe it’s

51:06
probably not.

51:09
It’s usually right after after? That’s the best time. But, you know, yeah, we heard from one we heard from one couple, this was a little while ago that she was just frustrated, because her husband did the same thing in the bedroom every time. And unpacking that. Like the reality is, there was one time back a long time ago that that thing worked. Well, he thought, hey, it worked, then let me just do it again. And it’ll work again, and so didn’t really understand that that’s not necessarily how she works. That’s not, you know, and just needed to unpack. How do I how do I functionally, you know, make her enjoy this, because, you know, I thought I had the secret formula, and there is no secret formula. But it’s, it’s helping guys understand that. And, and I think wives can be a huge help in that, in having that conversation. And just saying, you know, what, I really liked this position more, I really like, you know, when you do this, or I don’t like it when you do this, not as a negative, but just say, instead of that, could you do this, like, those are actually positive conversations that most of the time your husband would be happy to have?

52:24
Those kinds of conversations, we just have to enter them both listening really well, and not taking offense, understanding that it’s to understand each other better. That’s what intimacy is just knowing each other more and more. And I think, you know, too many times people have built up walls, and they just take offense when when somebody wants to have a conversation like that when one of the spouses wants to have a conversation. And so, yeah, just breaking down those walls and saying, I’m just trying to share, you know, from my heart, what works for you what I enjoy, and just trying to listen and hear each other and not take offense to what’s being said.

53:02
I just think that’s so good. And I actually misunderstood you, Brad. So you’re saying that the best time to talk about a good, you know, to talk is right after the afterglow of sex? Is that what you’re saying? Yes.

53:13
Yeah, that is, that’s often a really good time to have good conversations about lots of topics. Because chemically, emotionally, everything like you guys are, are in a place that you’re feeling pretty connected. You know, we often one of the studies that I love to quote often is, is that they’ve done some research on like connection in and sex and wives feel the most desire for sex when they feel the most connected in their marriage, where husbands feel the most connected in their marriage, just after having sex. And so sometimes, like that difference actually, like that often talks a lot about like, when you have a conflict, if your husband wants to have sex right away, and you’re like, wait, we’re in the middle of a conflict. It’s usually because of that, because they’re like, hey, if we just have sex, we’ll be connected and everything will be fine. And you’re, you know, the wife is saying, wait a minute, we need to get through this before I can even think about the desire to have that. So sometimes that after time, you’re both feeling pretty connected. And that’s a good time to sometimes have those conversations. If you

54:31
can keep them awake. Well,

54:33
they there are times that it’s perfect time to take a nap to

54:38
and usually so I just brilliant Okay, so wives feel the most desire for sex when they feel most connected in their marriage. And husbands feel the most connected in their marriage after they have sex with their right. Yeah. Oh, so good. That’s awesome. Well, you’re going to have to stay tuned until Thursday to hear the second half of this awesome interview. Just just just so good. So I’m going to also invite you to the webinar. Once again, that is tonight, and I am so excited, please set your alarm for 8pm Eastern Standard Time. And if you haven’t signed up, do so immediately. That’s 8pm Eastern Standard Time, I would just be so honored if you could be there with me. It’s live, it is free. And we really dive into what God has to say about your marriage, intimacy, and some spicy topics that you would be really surprised are outlined in the Bible. I believe God has some got some really amazing things to share with you. And I just keep getting feedback, you know, trickling in that people have really been impacted by that webinar. Again, I don’t record them because I want it to be an intimate real conversation between the two of us. And so it feels like the two of us just so you know, because you won’t ever hear or see any of the other people that are on there because it’s totally anonymous. But I would love for you to be there. I think God has got some awesome things he wants you to find out about your husband. So again, it’s called How to love Him most and you can sign up at delight your marriage.com/webinar Thank you so much. God bless you and we’ll talk soon.

56:22
Thanks for listening. If you’ve been blessed by this, why not share it. Until next time, live with love, wisdom and passion